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chrise

9th October 2021, 20:05
The "girl" was in a crossword I did a few days ago - I can't remember if it was Guardian or RT.
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malone

9th October 2021, 21:43
Grunger, I'm glad you too think some of the crossword words are past their prime. There was another 'grrr' one in a puzzle last month - Dreamboat. It must be at least 30 years since that was in common use.

ChrisE, I think the 'girl' is, too useful for setters - we'll probably be seeing her for years to come (though she'll maybe have a downturn in her fortunes and become a char or a daily?).
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grunger

10th October 2021, 19:05
chrise malone

The "girl presented" was also in the Times on Friday. I have no idea to whom or what she used to be presented, or from what she came out.
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jigjag

10th October 2021, 19:14
Grunger

I did not know that your versatility extended to accountancy, book-keeping etc.

Malone

I see that Emma has put out a desperate appeal for a coach. Perhaps you and Grunger could help, in tennis or fashion
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paulhabershon

10th October 2021, 19:51
Hey, stop dissing the debs! I've just won Clueless with
Backing for girl coming out on strike causes uproar (6)

A down clue for BEDLAM, to save you the effort.

This was set and judged by none other than the clue-writing serial winner 'buster' mattrom, perhaps Emma's next coach.
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malone

10th October 2021, 20:08
Well done, paul... - but I'm afraid any clue involving that dratted girl would get a big red X from me! The same goes for any clue involving it/IT, appeal, SA... and many other 'done to death' bits.

Jigjag
I'll assign Grunger to overseeing Emma's attire - and I'll happily take on the coaching role if I can bark out commands all day long. I won't know many of the technical terms, but will throw in the odd instruction such as 'time for an inside-outside backhand slice, surely?' Oh, and add a bit of topspin while you're at it.' I'm sure they use similar instructions in coaching sessions...
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mathprofrockstar

10th October 2021, 20:19
I don’t have a dislike for “deb” in a clue. It may not be so common any more, but I believe it used to be a typical common shortening. By not so common any more, I mean the whole notion of a debutante. Of course, I may be wrong, as those are certainly not the circles I am part of.
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mathprofrockstar

10th October 2021, 20:20
I completely agree on the “it” clues and their ilk though, as well as the “pi” for pious clues we have discussed before.
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paulhabershon

10th October 2021, 22:16
That's right, mathprof; debutantes are a legitimate part of social history. We should not erase them, otherwise we shouldn't have clues about suffragettes, for example, just because they aren't with us today. I accept that they may be overused, but that's true of many crossword devices (initially, starts to etc.).

Another extraordinary (as it seems now) example of the English class system was the annual first class cricket match, Gentlemen v Players. When playing for their counties the
gentlemen amateurs were listed on the scorecard with their initials and possibly used a different dressing room than the 'players' who were paid professionals and had just their surname on the scorecards and in newspaper reports. The last such match was in 1962 - the Gentlemen's last victory was in 1953. I still remember many of the amateur initials: P B H May, M C Cowdrey, E R Dexter, M J K Smith, G O Allen, D C S Compton. There was quite a furore when Len Hutton (you see, I don't know his full initials) became, I think, the first professional captain of the England team.
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grunger

11th October 2021, 11:10
Paul

Congratulations on your winning clue, which I like, especially the coming out on strike idea.

I thought Compton was a professional (cricket and football).

Malone

Yes I would be happy to handle the fashion if you and Mattrom do the tennis. Her appeal for any coaches out there was interesting. I will advise her to stick to tennis and leave the "out there" fashion to others.
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