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buddy

2nd November 2020, 21:18
The OED gives one and only one quotation for cirrate:

1826 W. Kirby & W. Spence Introd. Entomol. IV. xlvi. 321. Cirrate (Cirratæ). When the joints terminate in a pair of curling hairy branches resembling tendrils.

I guess given the number of Shakespearean and Spenserian words that are used in crosswords, only going back to 1826 makes it quite modern. Especially given how familiar most of us are with entomology textbooks from that era.
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ixion

2nd November 2020, 21:19
I must admit I was recently shocked and disappointed to find that Chambers did not have "outsider" in the sense of "either of the end pieces of a sliced loaf" : (
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rossim

2nd November 2020, 21:22
We've always called them crusts!
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ixion

2nd November 2020, 21:33
I'm referring to the end slices rossim, not the crust....
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rossim

2nd November 2020, 21:54
So was I, Ixion. We never had a special name for them!
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mathprofrockstar

2nd November 2020, 23:34
My parents called them the “heels.”
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mathprofrockstar

2nd November 2020, 23:35
I just checked and that definition is in Chambers. Let’s get this thing fired up again!
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loge

3rd November 2020, 09:23
The actual definitions in Chambers are:

cirrus: n the highest form of clouds, consisting of curling fibres; a tendril; any curled filament.
cirrate or cirriform adj like a cirrus.


It's therefore unfair to blame setters or editors for inferring that CIRRATE is the adjectival form of only one of the meanings of CIRRUS. Almost all solvers are unlikely to have come across CIRRATE in everyday life, and since the "wrong" definition is both plausible and lexicographically supported, why would they question it?

We all know there are a few dodgy or (as in this case) misleading definitions in Chambers, particularly in the area of science. But in practically all cases "it's in Chambers" is a perfectly reasonable justification for defining a word in a particular way. Solvers and setters both need an ultimate authority for settling such disputes, and I for one would prefer to place my trust in the work of professional lexicographers, slightly flawed though it may be.
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guybarry

3rd November 2020, 11:56
"I for one would prefer to place my trust in the work of professional lexicographers"

So do I.

"1 : bearing a cirrus. 2 : curled like a cirrus —used especially of a leaf tipped with a tendril." (Merriam-Webster)

"Biology: bearing or resembling cirri" (Collins)

"Biology. Having or resembling a cirrus or cirri." (The Free Dictionary)

Absolutely every other dictionary I've checked gives only the biological definition. The entry in Chambers is unfortunately ambiguous, and it looks as though the setter picked the wrong meaning without cross-checking it against other sources.

If definitions were routinely cross-checked, this sort of thing wouldn't happen. No dictionary is the ultimate authority on anything.
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jigjag

3rd November 2020, 12:34
guybarry

I agree with you.
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