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I defer to the links that mamya has put up!

Yes thanks Mamya.

Thanks mamya I will have a look at the site in a mo. Andyc I have always thought the two clues were related, as in the mail a few days ago with pompeii, versus and rematch. That was blown out of the water the day before yesterday with Heap and white sauce, couldn't see the link anywhere. Thanks anyway, Keep that leg elevated.

Lazy on my part really as I usually try to ignore them, as you say very often a misdirection.

Didn't for a second think you were being patronising mamya.

Oh thank you :-)

Thanks to one and all for the earlier
explanation of "optics" - will remember
that next time I order a pint!

I've never seen beer on an aoptic - would be an extremely large one!

I also defer to mamya's link in post 9. Although I remember when I started doing xwords over 50 years ago the ..... always used to indicate a link to the previous clue (however tenuous) Nowadays it is usually meaningless

Chrise the beer optics are the big silvery coloured ones.lol